New number one needed (4 Viewers)

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
So the strategy should be pretty simple.

1. Do objective analysis (data) on loads of players to identify targets.
2. Do subjective analysis (scouting) on those targets to look for any other abilities/deficiencies that the data might not highlight, as well as doing background on personality and lifestyle.

This is what the club does.

Ironically, the signings that attract the most negative comments from fans; JDS, Collins, Palmer were brought in on AV’s recommendation. The most subjective analysis, he used to coach them and in some cases, knows the players exceptionally well. See Collins story about how AV help him cope with the loss of his dad.

The eye test is a funny thing and because ‘beauty is in the eye of the beholder’ is generally the reason data analysis (‘Moneyball’) has taken over.
 

skybluecam

Well-Known Member
The stats are accurate but it doesn't cover the whole picture of what we see in games. Some errors have completely cost us complete games so not a standard missed save, what do you count on stats for Hull's third goal or QPR's second?
Commanding your box etc is not truly covered.
It's interesting that people will reject statistics because they're not perfect and instead choose to rely on human opinion...

Spend 5 minutes on this forum and you'll find a range of opinions about every single player in the squad. The value of stats is their objectivity.
 

Hertsccfc

Well-Known Member
It's interesting that people will reject statistics because they're not perfect and instead choose to rely on human opinion...

Spend 5 minutes on this forum and you'll find a range of opinions about every single player in the squad. The value of stats is their objectivity.
Most people love stats when they confirm their opinions but reject them when they don't.
 

JimmyHillsbeard

Well-Known Member
Corey Addai currently playing for Crawley in the playoffs vs MKDons (Liam Kelly scored but calm down it’s not him). Addai is apparently a real prospect as a keeper-sweeper according to the reporter.
 

thekidfromstrettoncamp

Well-Known Member
Looking at the stats according to them Collins (better than the Rotherham Keeper) is the best shot stopper % wise of anyone player playing more than an odd game.People always remember the silly mistakes all keeper make them.Seen some howlers from PL goalkeepers in the past 7 days and these players cost and get paid far more.
I find fans always seem to think that other teams players are great when they only see highlights ie the knocking of Eccles some on here have got to keep on have your say leave it then.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
It's interesting that people will reject statistics because they're not perfect and instead choose to rely on human opinion...

Spend 5 minutes on this forum and you'll find a range of opinions about every single player in the squad. The value of stats is their objectivity.
Objective but potentially flawed/incomplete.
 

Mild-Mannered Janitor

Kindest Bloke on CCFC / Maker of CCFC Dreams
It's interesting that people will reject statistics because they're not perfect and instead choose to rely on human opinion...

Spend 5 minutes on this forum and you'll find a range of opinions about every single player in the squad. The value of stats is their objectivity.
I value the stats like I said but they don’t always give the full picture as they are a limited set. He has been a better keeper but his stats and play in the latter games were not as high as before.
Even the Hull game, he made some great saves but one complete clanger gifted the game away.
 

Houdi

Well-Known Member
There are lies ,damned lies and statistics. Sadly what we are seeing is the creeping Americanisation of the sport with this obsession with statistics.
Just look at some American sports where they have a statistic for every conceivable situation. The NFL GOAT is considered to be Tom Brady yet he was taken in the 6th round, he was nearer to being Mr Irrelevant than being the number1 overall pick.Yet each team have 100's of analysts, pro days ,the combine, team workouts they measure every part of their bodies ,time a 40 yard dash ,blah blah and yet every year 1st round picks are busts and lower end picks blossom.
I used to know the guy at the Coventry Blaze who did the gamesheet. The refs often gave an assist to a goal to a player who wasn't even on the ice, players would often come over to the box to try and blag an assist for a goal to pad their stats, No OG in ice hockey so a shot going wide which hits a defender the errant shooter is credited with the goal. Yes even the goalie has stats, so many poor shots that a keeper doesn't even save but just hits him in the body count on his stats.
Anybody with a functioning brain, who has seen/watched the last few matches could tell Collins has been poor. No amount of stats can cover that up, and i expect there is no stat that covers a player bottling a challenge or being seemingly terrified of physical contact.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
First thing I learned about data: all models are wrong, some models are useful.

Where data has been very useful is unearthing players we wouldn’t have looked at. You can’t capture everything about a human or even close, but the data gives you a sense check, a point in the right direction, and the ability to trawl tens of thousands of players at once with a small budget.

For analysis it gives you solid shared reality for discussion. We do remember things that confirm our biases or shock us more than other stuff. I can think Jamie Allen never touched the ball but can check who scored and see he touched it a whopping 4 times so obviously I need to check my biases next time.

Why anyone would be against it I don’t know.
 

Boicey

Well-Known Member
We need a keeper who will be vocal in organising the defence at set pieces in my opinion. The defence needs to know what the keeper will be doing (ie coming for the ball ). In this instance defenders can concentrate on marking attackers rather than wondering what the hell the keeper is doing .
And that is part of the problem with stats.
How do you measure assertiveness, bravery, presence, vocality, leadership?
All vital for a keeper.
All can lead to incidents which absolute stats then measure. Some of which can put the keeper in a good light when they are anything but.
 

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
We need a keeper who will be vocal in organising the defence at set pieces in my opinion. The defence needs to know what the keeper will be doing (ie coming for the ball ). In this instance defenders can concentrate on marking attackers rather than wondering what the hell the keeper is doing .
So goalie stats need to include their BPM - bollockings per match.
 

JSL

Well-Known Member
In true ex Chelsea youth player style, I have just discovered that the Chelsea Youth FA cup winning side from 2016 had a goalkeeper named Nathan Baxter who now plays for Bolton. Bolton are in the league 1 playoffs. Should they not get promoted, watch this space with their goalkeeper. You know how it goes with ex Chelsea youth players.............
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Noticed on Simon Moore's Instagram farewell that Wilson commented something along the lines about how unfairly he was treated. It seems a strange thing for a player to say in public unless he's off as well.

He was telling people at the awards he’s been told to find a new club wasn’t he?
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
Noticed on Simon Moore's Instagram farewell that Wilson commented something along the lines about how unfairly he was treated. It seems a strange thing for a player to say in public unless he's off as well.
There's never been any rumours of a falling out or anything has there and the club seems leaky as fuck so not like it would have been the only thing they ever managed to keep secret.

Maybe something happened in his personal life. He seemed to go from being pretty solid to looking like he'd never played a game in his life. Sad to see. There's a few comments in there about the last couple of years that could be taken as relating to something non-football related happening in his life.

Hope it all works out for him, never nice to see someone fall from first team regular to not ever getting a place on the bench.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
There's never been any rumours of a falling out or anything has there and the club seems leaky as fuck so not like it would have been the only thing they ever managed to keep secret.

Maybe something happened in his personal life. He seemed to go from being pretty solid to looking like he'd never played a game in his life. Sad to see. There's a few comments in there about the last couple of years that could be taken as relating to something non-football related happening in his life.

Hope it all works out for him, never nice to see someone fall from first team regular to not ever getting a place on the bench.
He had some personal issues
 

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